E38 – Stand Out, Make an Impact, Get Personal! Increasing Your Degree of Trust Using Emotional Relevance with Alon Zaibert

We all have something to sell. It could be ourselves, our product, our ideas. As someone who has gone through an investor pitch several times, I can tell you from experience that the dynamic is much much different when the people at the table know each other versus a first time meeting. Having emotional relevancy and trust in that situation can make or break the momentum in any deal. So whether you are building a product (solution) and need investment, a customer, a partner or someone to open a door or two, you will get something out of this episode.

In this episode, I spoke with Alon Zaibert, Master of Emotional Relevancy about trust, and forming a deeper connection with those who you interact with. We discuss why that is important and how to go about doing it, even if you are shy and/or introverted. In order to be successful in your interpersonal and business relationships, Alon says you must:

Stand out! Make an impact! Get Personal!

Watch here:

Connect:
Alon Zaibert (LinkedIn) – https://www.linkedin.com/in/alonzaibert/
Homepage – https://www.alonzaibert.com/

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Transcript

Nick
And we're back. This is the Coverager Podcast, we're going to take a little bit different tack today and discuss something that I think is vitally missing in the business world. But for those that listen to the Coverager Podcast in our specific realm, in insurance, finance, banking, insuretech, investments and technology and all of that...trust...I've brought it up before. And, you know, if you follow me on social media, you know that I spend a little bit of time talking about it. But what better way to talk about it and bring someone who who does it every single day, kind of lives it and preaches it, and has a unique perspective that I think can help professionals and corporations. Think about it in a particularly different way that can actually help in business, in sales and in other areas. Alon Zaibert, welcome to the Coverager Podcast.

Alon Z
Thank you very much, man. Happy to be here.

Nick
Thanks. I love the little tagline underneath your name and LinkedIn...master of emotional relevance, and even get that trademarked just beautiful.

Alon Z
Isn't that amazing? That I, I established I created a term in the English language. Right? It's, it's me it's it's mine.

Nick
Yes. And and, and as a backdrop, you are Israeli. So English is the second language but you speak it fluently and beautifully. I love the accent. And you actually came up with something that was unique, which is very hard to do, given like the hundreds of years that we've had English that not every word has been trademarked in some way or another. So congratulations to you. Alon, I, and all of these podcasts that I do I always give my guests a little bit of soapbox. For an elevator pitch. Who are you? What do you do? And why is it important? Why are we having this discussion?

Alon Z
Yeah, you know, it's I always pause and think Who am I? And why are we doing this? So you mentioned emotional relevance. And you know, about three years ago, I started writing about emotional relevance. And I started writing, blog sharing, use cases and stories. But it all came from people who get to know me, in the corporate world and friends, and have seen me interact with other people. Right, and they a lot like, along the years, people who have seen me work and interact with other people would say, How did you do that? or How did you get away? You know, with that? How did you get away? How did you get them to feel that? How did you get that results? And for me, it was all natural. You know, in a nutshell, what it came down to is I say out loud what a lot of other people think. And it almost get to a point where it gives them permission. You know, everybody looked like Did he? Okay, he did that he got away with it. Okay, we can do that as well. And I'm not talking about anything, you know, drastic, but it's, it's the human element of things. So, you know, in a way I have, I've gone on a crusade media crusade to bridge that gap between what corporate is dictating to us as human beings, right, which is, you know, the guidelines, the rules, the dance in the corporate world, how to behave, versus the innate human needs, that are built in, in all of us, as human beings as human beings, which relates to how we feel what emotions are, and that our need to be connected, I need to be socially accepted, which then comes to trust being remembered and all of those elements that I use when I work with my customers and executives on emotional relevance. Just to finish it up by saying, Nick, I didn't invent anything except for the term. Right? emotional relevance is based on neuroscience, psychology, and emotional intelligence. The good news for me is that now Unfortunately, due to the pandemic, right, that's the unfortunate piece. But the fortunate piece is, I just go every day now saying I told you so because the pandemic triggered, you know, people to be more emotionally open, and more emotionally sharing and more, you know, less corporate because we are in zoom Land, right? And in zoom land, we are by default more intimate, right? You're in my home. Now I'm in your home, even though I see that you're you have a beach background, but it's more intimate. It's us. It's one on one. Yeah, we don't have to dress up to go to work. Right? We don't have to be careful of what we say in the hallway. Right? So it gets us to be more us. Going back to that circle that I started. Basically, what I do is I give people in the workplace permission to be more them.

Nick
Yeah. And that's a very compelling thing that I want, we want to dig in. And by the way, so I don't think this would ever be allowed. And we'll see if I can get it. There's my knee...shorts every day. I do live in Florida. So it's, you know, like, it's kind of par for the course, here. But yeah, like, it's amazing how much the world has changed, and that I told you, so, moment has happened for a lot of people, you know, we've been a lot of the peers that I work with, have been really pounding the table for years about work from home, and, you know, allowing that sort of flexibility. And it's funny, like how rapidly it happened and how everyone just sort of accepted like, Oh, I guess, I guess, I guess you don't have to wear a tie, I guess you can grow a beard. You know, everyone had COVID hair, right? For a while is kind of like a thing, I still kind of have COVID here, it's coming back. Um, you know, and yet, I would say, people, employees really stepped up. Um, and this is something that I had seen long ago, when I my first taste of working from home, I had the opposite problem of what I think a boss, you know, someone who's, who has workers that report to them with think when you allow someone to work from home, you think like, well, I don't know what they're doing. Right? Um, you know, how do I know that they're actually getting work done? And I had the opposite problem where I was working too much. Yeah. And I think everyone else is starting to realize that as well, is that you have the is truly you have the opposite problem. It's hard to shut things off. But let me

Alon Z
use that real quick as a segue to, you know, trust. Right, which is what we're talking about, because it's all about trust, eventually, do I trust my colleague or my employee, To work enough hours to produce enough? Without me looking at them? Right?

Nick
It's silly, right? Like it in, in, in reality, that a, someone who's leading a team would have to, like literally be watching them. Yeah, but it's silly.

Alon Z
You look at historically, how, you know, how the whole, you know, corporate world has evolved. And people, you know, going to offices, and, you know, putting that little card in the clock to make sure that, yeah, working it all, if you think about the American society in general, you know, it's got to be managed somehow, right? That's how how it started entrepreneur, entrepreneurial. lism started, you know, I remember where I went to school first time ever for entrepreneurship class that was, you know, late nine, late 1990s, the late 90s. This is when entrepreneurship kind of terminology, you know, started to be blend in. And now, you know, working from anywhere, because of the technology because of online world, and everything else is being more accessible. So I think trust takes a little, a little different angle. Well, you know, it's very interesting, Nick, I did a survey about a year and a half ago, with some organizations that I've worked with. And some of it is around trust. Just to recap, you know, people ask me emotional relevance, what's the what's the purpose of it, the underline of it is really two things is to be remembered, and to establish trust, right? ongoing trust. And we'll talk about what it means in a second. But I did a survey a couple years ago, with some organizations. And I asked we asked the the group that we worked with, tell us about each one else. Everyone else only group tell us two personal things about the other, the other people in the group right? All colleagues are all working together for months. We did it with groups of six to about 1314 people. Right? And the answers were, by far very superficial. Oh, they like coffee. They love cats. Right? They live in, you know, they Oh, they like the Red Sox now, right?

Nick
Yes!

Alon Z
They things like that. Right. But recently, I've done the survey again, with the groups that I've worked with. And the answers have changed. Right? Because it's not it's no longer just they like coffee. Right? But they like drinking coffee in a in a in a glass mug. And they like it very hot. Right? So it gets to that level, they actually, you know, lost a loved one recently. And because the environment is allowing us to do that, but it's just allowing us. We've always been emotional creatures. We've always been, you know, looking for the connection. But we haven't been given the permission to do so. Yeah, in the corporate world. And it pisses me off, Nick, I'm sorry, I get passionate about it. It pisses me off. Because you know, when you go to talk to people and sell or meet with colleagues, or customers or partners doesn't matter who right now and you meet with them face to face before their pandemic. Everything in the room in front of everybody had guidelines, you're not supposed to cross the line, God forbid you say something, God forbid you. you hug somebody. You know, I finished a presentation a couple years ago, and I worked for this corporate in the corporate world still, and I finished a presentation somewhere in the Midwest doesn't matter. And we said our goodbyes after two hours presentation. And we really established a relationship there. And you could tell that you know, some of the people that before we left, you know we're coming in to appreciate you and their natural instinct is to give you a hug. And two of them when I because I'm a hugger, right? We literally had each other this is a prospect, brand name prospect rehabbed. Okay, now they loved it. Everybody else loved it. No problem, but corporate world. So of course, there was somebody in the room that then felt uncomfortable about it, whether it because they didn't receive the Aga whether because it was different, right. And it drives me nuts. But you know, that when you take your prospect, one on one on the side in the hallway, or you meet for dinner later, and you talk, all the guidelines are thrown away, all of a sudden you cost and all of a sudden you you know, you talk about family? And what why is that is because we need that. So, what I'm saying is, why not blend it? Nick white? really tell me why not be because it's unprofessional. Why so make it professional? Because we've been told for years that it's, you know, a guideline. But the thing is that when you do that, first of all, it's more natural for us. When you do that openness level goes up, trust level goes up, I want to do business more with you because I trust you more and I am closing rates go up. Right. But well, go ahead.

Nick
No, I it because you hit on something that I think is very important that there's there's an element of authenticity to it. When you you know, when you know that someone has a family and or they've had this, you know, a child that has some sort of health condition. Like you step into their world and you get to know them a little bit more, you can start to connect some dots around them and who they are and how they behave and what they've been able to overcome. It does increase the level of trust that you have, you prefer to work with someone that you understand a little bit better, or has characteristics that you admire, and things like that. And so I agree with you Like, why not like there's a level of professionalism there that I think you can add to that. It's, we were talking before we started we talking about trust as like the soft mushy thing.

Alon Z
Because, again, because we've been programmed You know, my Daughter plays volleyball. She made the varsity team this year as a freshman in our high school team and, and I am, I'm one of those parents on the stands that I yell go crazy, crazy. I don't cuss. I don't you know, but I go crazy. I'm emotionally and I'm loud, I'm emotional, I'm allowed, etc. We still I live in a pretty waspy area. Okay, there are guidelines there. Right? I don't know if you've seen the movie. Bad mugs. Similar, right? So kind of like that. The beginning of the season all the parents first game, right? Like, oh, oh, this, this guy is a little. It's a little too much. Right? By the end of the season. We have all the parents we have chance together. And everybody is, you know, in the day of the game, everybody goes on the group chat and go crazy. And put means and stuff. All I did was I given them permission to be them. We're still professional about it. Right? And we talk sometimes to other parents at the other teams, right? When they come first five minutes, first few minutes, they hear us were loud. And they're like, but then you talk to them. And like, that's, yeah, we would love to be part of that. Right? Same thing. So let's do a little exercise that I mean, by the way, just for the record, I don't, you know, go to my customers and say, oh, at the end of the meeting, go hug them. Jump on them and hug them. Right, that will give you trust No.

Nick
Just be authentic. Let's prove who you are. And

Alon Z
let's do a little exercise.

Nick
Sure.

Alon Z
Would I have known each other for a couple months? Not too much.

Nick
Okay, a few months, a little longer than that?

Alon Z
A few months, but we don't really know each other? Well, Nick. I mean, I think you like me for what you've seen, I like you for what I've seen. But really, all together, we have a few hours of communication. One to 10 level of trust that you and I have. Right now, instinctively, if I come now to talk to you about work related stuff, because that's where we, you know, we're trying to kind of relate to that work related stuff, one to 10. I'm trying to sell you something or I want to offer you something or you would offer me one to 10? Where would you say our trust is roughly five, six, maybe four?

Nick
I would say six? Because I do know you a little bit. So I'm at least going to hear. I'm going to listen to it to see if it rings true. Whereas the same message given from someone I don't know, I may just I shut down? Yep. Immediately.

Alon Z
Awesome. So let's pause for one second, right, put it at six. And let's talk about establishing trust. And then we'll move to ongoing trust because there's a big difference. And first of all, what is trust in the world of corporate and world of business? It's it basically comes down to do I believe you that what you say is real? Do I believe that you bring benefit to me in our work relationship? Do I feel right that I don't need to that I can be as authentic as possible and that you are being authentic? Now how do you get there? Obviously, there are a few ways one is your own reputation. If you look online, and you see that I have been doing this and that other people say that about me, right? That automatically gives me some credibility, which establish a level of trust, but not until you actually experience and in emotional relevance methodology I talked about emotionally experience. Right, me and what I do for you. Only then my when I call trust is being established. You wanted to say something?

Nick
No, I want to dig into that. I want to dig into that further. Because I think you you sort of hit on something in the way that I described trust as well. And I think that's very important. Because I think, listen, I think most people who are listening to this are going to say, Oh, I know what trust is. Right. And you hit on something that's very important. So in, in, in my case, right? I'm let's say I'm selling something to you. You just said oh, I go on LinkedIn. I checked in my LinkedIn profile. My business is in insurance. Right? Let's say I'm selling you, heavy machinery. Caterpillar. excavator. Yeah, right. Why would I be trustworthy to you? You're gonna look through my LinkedIn, I may be a good guy, you might say, Nick's a good guy, I like him. But in that particular scenario, I am not trustworthy. I cannot deliver trust to you, because you just scan through my LinkedIn profiles. Look, Nick knows nothing. There's nothing that shows that Nick knows anything about excavators. He doesn't know anything about rocket science, he doesn't know anything about, you know, fixing electrical equipment, the only thing I could bring to the table that would really raise level of trust would be if I was probably selling you something that was related to insurance, because I have an entire career around that that would at least raise the level of trust. And and I think that's a very important aspect to this.

Alon Z
Well, absolutely. Look, there a couple of things here, one, if you're not related to what you're selling, or you don't have experience that, you know, that's going to be hard to establish trust, right? Just like everything else. Today, you go to a restaurant, you check out the reviews, right? How much do you trust the reviews? Or you trust the restaurant? Right? You see people that have eaten their show their own pictures versus the the website of the restaurant, right? You're looking for a house, you check out the neighborhood, you see reviews? You look, you're looking for a job? You're looking at Glassdoor today, you see all the feedback, right. So that's the reputation. But there's another thing that you talked about, which is what it is that you're selling. And different services slash products require different level of trust from the buyer in order to buy, right in order for me to buy a pen from you, I don't really need to establish a high, high level of trust. Right, I look it up, see the price. I know it works great. Next, right. But if I'm buying insurance from you, and it's, you know, life insurance, or work, insurance doesn't matter what it is, but insurance, now we're getting to some personal now we're getting for, I want to trust my insurance agent, right? So they will be there when I need them. Now we're getting to the emotional piece. And this is why as a side note, my most of my customers, they sell their businesses service and product, and it's a longer sales cycle, sophisticated relationship that requires a high level of trust. Right, this is where I bring the most value. So there is again, establishing trust. And then there's the ongoing. So obviously, if you're selling me a caterpillar, and I'm going to look you up immediately, I'm going to throw any aside and say I'm not trustworthy.

Nick
Like why would Why would you trust? Why would you trust me to say, Oh, this is the best Caterpillar, I'll use my my Donald Trump, this is the best Caterpillar there's never been a better anyways. Um, that's important, right? So because the for most of the audience that's listening, I think the vast majority of transactions that do occur for members of my audience here are long sales cycles. So this could be, you know, I'm a insure tech company that's coming in and looking to form a relationship with let's say, you know, a large European reinsure, and it could take two to three years for them to finally ink the contract and go through. And so they're, you know, the, the European reinsurer can't look at the company's website and sit and see, oh, they sell caterpillars. That's, that's odd, right, if they're coming to us to form a insurance relationship, but their website has caterpillars. So you're right. Like there's that there's that first impression element to it. And then there's like, you need to maintain that. I would even I wouldn't even push back and say beyond maintain it like it is your responsibility to keep feeding it so that it grows and matures beyond just maintain keep instead of keeping a parallel, you have to grow it. So

Alon Z
yeah. So let me talk about that real quick. First of all, today, we have multiple channels of communication, right? phones, zoom email, you know, LinkedIn messenger, yeah. So, when we establish a relationship, one of the first thing I want to work with people is to make every channel of communication right impactful and make it a two way channel of communication. Establish channels of communication, early in the relationship that are two way channel of communication. Now, how do you do that? You you establish something relevant in there. Those are those emotional anchors. I'm referring to, let's go back to our little scenario for and show you an example. We were at six, and we are just now starting our relationship. Let's say we're talking about you're selling me now insurance, because that's what you're selling. And or, you know, vice versa. I'm selling you now some consulting about emotional relevance, relationship, etc. for your customers, you are seeking some guidance, and you're not sure, etc. And I know last time we talked, you went on vacation. I think you went to North Carolina, right? Who did you go with?

Nick
family? Wife & kids?

Alon Z
How many kids? Two? Do you mind if I ask how old? Four into four and two? Did you go hiking

Nick
or? Yes, every day

Unknown Speaker
with the 4 & 2?

Nick
the two year old was on my back. The four year old was a problem. I burned a lot of calories. boy/boy. They're

Alon Z
both boys their names?

Nick
Harrison and Ollie.

Alon Z
Give me just very quickly one example of a problem. That was it. Which one of them is the four year old? Harrison? Harrison is a four year old example of a problem one day you woke up. And you're in North Carolina beautiful views? Probably great time of the of the year, right?

Nick
Yes. Beautiful.

Alon Z
And you pack your bags and you go into hike. What happens with Harrison?

Nick
He's behind me. just staring...throwing rocks. Like Come on. Let's go. So I'm spending all my time with my arms crossed. Okay, let's go. Okay, let's go. Okay, I'm leaving you. And you know, whatever tool I have to get him to move faster. And he's taking his damn sweet time.

Alon Z
So now I want to ask you something. Nick, let's go back to our discussion. The podcast here real quick. For a few seconds. Did you feel it?

Nick
Feel what?

Alon Z
You feel the connection?

Nick
Sure.

Yeah. I mean, you're. So I'm getting I'm getting able to brag about my kids and stuff.

Alon Z
So yes, it's a little trick. Yes, it's a little sales mechanism. But one of the things that because it's a long term relationship, right? In insurance, like I said that a year, two years, etc. Then I teach people to be able to feel comfortable and genuine, to ask those questions and actually get to know one another. It's been proven that when you talk about something personal, I have a much higher tendency now to share with you about my kids, and about a hike that I had in the past. Okay, so now, point number one. I can guarantee you that if I asked you right now, a second after you told me the story shared with us. Thank you very much thought about Harrison. That six is now probably touching an eight.

Nick
I I'll say seven,

Alon Z
seven. I'll take 7, 22 seconds. One personal question. And it's at seven. Right? So this is one example of little thing establishing a little trust and what I call emotional anchor. Now, let's go back to the channels of communication. We talked, and I told you what I do. You showed some interest, then, let's say it's a Thursday, Tuesday. I'm telling you, I'm going to get back to you Tuesday, let you think about it for a few days. And let's say that I happen to go on a hike during that weekend. Or maybe not, doesn't matter. But I'm thinking and when you said a minute ago, that you need to be aware of it and feel that this is your responsibility to proactively now be thinking about you make your hike your needs. Harrison, so I'm thinking and all of a sudden I'm driving and I see a poster with the word Harrison or something. Now that reminds me of your kids. Guess what, on the email that I'm sending you Tuesday, I'm sending you a picture of that poster Harrison. What I did there is I triggered that emotional anchor again. Right and I shared with you how much I care. By the way. It happens to me all the time because I'm aware today I have a friend in Dallas. She's amazing. Carrie, nevermind she does coaching and consulting and she's amazing, but her son is crazier. She has a Little boy, Nicolas, Nicolas, her a he's crazy about fans, ceiling fans fans crazy. She actually wrote a children's book above it. They opened a new store today in my down my neighborhood, I drove my son earlier to, to football practice. And I saw this store and I said, Oh my God, thank God, it's red light, because I got to take a picture and I took a picture. Can you? Can you see this?

Nick
Yes, fan city. Dan's fan city.

Alon Z
Now I'm going to send it to her. She's a friend. Right? We sometimes consult one another, etc. But it's the same making I'm gonna send it to her. What is she gonna feel when I send it to her?

Nick
Yeah, yeah, definitely.

Alon Z
Yeah. When I said earlier, emotional relevance is about being remembered. And establishing trust. And

Nick
I want to share a story because your story reminds me I guess I had been doing something like that for a long time and not even realizing I had been doing it. So and in my business, we were dealing with a broker who was, you know, a broker is kind of very transactional. She was I guess it on the surface, she seemed, um, heart hardened. Right. But she's a broker, you know, she's like, you know, move quickly, and get me my price and all this other stuff. And I called I called her because in to apologize for not fulfilling what it is that we were going to do and try to explain ourselves. And I got to know her a little bit, like you said, just like, few seconds. And she was it was a Friday afternoon, and she was telling me about her chickens. And I said, chickens, okay. And so I remembered it. And I got to like, maybe three, four weeks later, I just happened to remember chickens. And I sent her a little note, I said, Hey, can you send me a picture of your chickens? Yeah, right. Her girls, she called them. So she sent me a picture of the chickens. And now we have a running conversation about her chickens. And guess what? Is she's still "hard". Yeah, she's broker she's got she's got customers, she needs to satisfy and she has high expectations of us. But is does she reflect that hardened, You know, emotions towards us? No, she's much more accommodating. She's much more understanding when we do kind of fall down, we will apologize, but she's much more understanding about it, the dynamics of the relationship have changed. Because of chickens!

Alon Z
that's, that's that, first of all, you stumbled upon it. And you just realize now what you've done? Yeah, I take that mechanism. And I teach people not only to do it, but maintain it and continue with it. So you are happy with it. you've established an emotional anchor. And when I say emotional, sometimes people think, no, it doesn't have to be anything big. It's got to be something personal, it's got to be maybe different. But now how do you utilize it over time and establish new anchors, so you can establish through different channels of communication over time?

Nick
Okay, I Alon, I'm gonna stop because I think they're gonna be a lot of folks that might be listening to this that might be you know, quote unquote, shy, or introverted, that may feel very uncomfortable trying to establish that emotional anchor. What How would you How would you advise them or counsel them on on things that they might be able to do? I have a few ideas on what they might be able to do that it could ease it, but I'd like to get your feedback on that.

Alon Z
First of all, you're right. The 3 pillars of emotional relevance are 1. stand out, 2. make an impact and 3. get personal. And the get personal one is the most uncomfortable one. Again because of our society here I don't know if you're aware but America here the US is the one of the top touch phobic societies in the world. Okay, and when I say touch phobic, it's not just physical touch. It's the personal space is the mental touch. So we've been taught all these years not to get too close to to others, etc. Now, now alone, you come and say no, no, no, get close to them. Right. So it's, it's hard. So first of all, it takes practice. It takes practice. I do a lot of practice with my customers. I do a lot of scenarios and case studies and role playing, etc. This is one. two...

Unknown Speaker
There are tricks. elements, right? A lot of times before you go and address a person, a prospect or a customer, etc. And you feel a little uncomfortable. What I do is have people go through in their mind taking one minute in your mind run a specific scenario. One example is scenario where let's say it's a Thursday evening. You just finished a long day on the road, traveling meeting smiling all day, even though you didn't need to want to. All you want right now. You finished dinner. It's 8:30pm you're heading to your hotel. All you want right now is a cold beer, Nick, and talk to nobody. Yes, correct. Yes. Good. Yes. You know, there's a little bar by the hotel, you walk in, you sit down by the bar, you ordered a beer. First, emotionally relevant question is, what is your favorite beer? What are you ordering?

Nick
Yes, give me Yeah. Ah, Sam Adams.

Alon Z
Sam Adams...bottle or a glass?

Nick
depends on the mood. I'm not I'm I'm not arrogant. So bottle

Alon Z
bottle. Awesome. I want you to think for a second that you're holding the bottle and feel for a few seconds how cold your head feels. I really want you to feel it. Then as you're kind of turning around and about, kind of, you know, you're already salivating and you're feeling like you know, you're going to get that drink that first drink after a long day, you loosen your tie. And this guy just walks by you and by mistake bumps into you and you drop the beer on the floor. You're so tired. And you look at him. He looks at you. And you just chuck off any signals the bartender Hey, give my new friend here. Another bottle another our own me. And of course he looks at you. I'm sorry. When the end he sits next to you. And he says, What's your name? You go it's Nick. I make them. I'm Jim. Where you from? Yeah, I'm from Florida. What do you do? This is the mood you need to be in, to be able to be to imagine, really imagine that you are now talking to a friend. You're very relaxed. You're very calm. You're not trying to sell anything you don't try. You're not in that environment, because that environment triggers our sense.

Nick
Yeah. Wait, yeah, it's a it's funny. It's funny that you brought up like this specific example, because I was specifically thinking of, I can think of three things Alon, where it almost doesn't matter what sort of meeting I'm in. Right investor pitch, you know, stakeholder meeting, board meeting. Three things always come up. When you travel. It's how did you get here? like did you fly? What airline what airport? How was the flight? Was it late? Did you go through O'Hare? It almost it almost always comes up? Where are you from? Almost always comes up. And that links to a whole bunch of other stuff. If you're listening to this, and you're shy and introverted, almost everybody follows a sports team. So when when I say I'm from Boston, or someone says, Hey, I'm from Chicago, I will say oh, you a Bears fan, Bulls?. You know, like, I immediately and I'm kind of I, I appear extroverted to people, but I'm really introverted. And so having conversations is emotionally draining. But I know I can always count on that. Like your I get, I can see your from your LinkedIn, your in Atlanta, I would ask like, Oh, you follow the Falcons? And you might say no, I'm a, I'm a Green Bay Packers fan. And I would say Oh, how does how did that happen? But I think the important point here...

Alon Z
How did that happen...we were off to we were up 28-3 in the third quarter. How did that happen!?

Nick
I wasn't I wasn't gonna bring that up. I wasn't gonna bring that up. But um, you know, that's a key element that I want people who are listening to this to sort of grab on to is that it doesn't like that happens in all meetings. And so whether you're asking for money, asking for the sale, like those are conversations that you can have that I think get really swing back to if you can just get comfortable with those basic things. You will establish a level of emotional attachment to them you may not get the sale this isn't like you know, hard clothes or whatever. But you're you like you said like you started with that one to 10 rank You want to like start inching up and start getting things in your favor. And part of doing that is establishing that emotional connection to someone.

Alon Z
And this is where it's the ongoing piece, right? When you share personal stuff on, you know, in an ongoing manner. Over time, you open up more and more, right trust level goes up. Like I said, openness goes up. All of a sudden, by the way, you both tend to share more information about the work, because your conversations primarily at work, yes, you're going to have some personal information. And if you like each other awesome, go be friends, I'm all for it. But people will share more about work with you, which will help you serve them better. Right now, you touch something very interesting which I work with foreign companies about how to sell in American through emotional relevance. Because you mentioned you have customers in Europe, etc. There's a whole new level of establishing trust through intercultural differences. Right? And how do you do that? Because one of the things that foreign look, Nick, if nothing else, if if people are listening here now, and they get bored, or they didn't listen, one thing, one thing is just be aware, as I mentioned earlier, and you said it yourself, it's there, they ask you where you from? And don't just take those answers and do nothing with them. Right? save those answers, get to know that people take down notes, because it will come up later.

And you're building all this information.

Nick
I mean, let me ask you, do you have a technique to save information aside from like, someone taking notes? I'm like, Yeah, you do you store that away?

Alon Z
CRM, if you want to scale and you have multiple customers? CRM, yes, I take notes on the CRM, by the way. It depends which CRM you use, etc. But every CRM has a place for notes, and you can add whatever you want. So I put the date and personal information that I learned every

Nick
conversation, you learn something when I'm thinking of all of the different conversations where I learn about, you know, some, with stakeholders are some partners, children's names, things like that, that if

Unknown Speaker
if you and I

Alon Z
speak in two weeks, let's say you call me in two weeks and say, Hey, I have a partner that is interested to talk to you, etc. And

I don't even want to sell you anything. But what if I tell you

in two weeks, three weeks, we talk in a month? And I tell you hey, Nick, by the way, how's Harrison? Not? How's your son?

Nick
Yeah, like that, that the difference between those two statements is massive. Massive just it's it because it in a very subtle way you're signaling signaling to me, like I meant something like that the details were meaningful to you. And you actually, in a way it made me feel special.

Alon Z
But that's exactly it, right? being remembered and establish trust. Now, people might say, Well, I don't like to get personal. That's fine. Okay, I won't ask you about your kid. But hey, Nick, I just saw yesterday, an article about Yeah, North Carolina, and hiking over there. Look at this, I'll send you a link about that via text or something like that. Again, it makes you feel special. You know, I always tell you know, whoever I work with, make sure that even if it's your thousandth customer, make sure that they feel like they're the only one. And those are the little things that will make them feel special. We all like to feel hugged. We in in that way. Okay. Not necessarily physically hug some people don't like dogs fine. But all of us like to feel connected like to feel accepted. And like to feel special. And this is how we make others feel special. Yes, you have to work at it. Yes, you have to practice you have to be aware. Be aware,

right? I learned so many things.

Even though you're hosting me I learned so much about you today. And again, over time, over time you building things and you keep doing those circles that I and again I call them emotional anchors and and going back and triggering that emotional, a anchor that you that you established. So it's work. It's work but

Nick
yeah, but if you so if you want to make the sale, if you want to get the investment if you want the partnership Like, that's what you have to do. You know, it's you. And and and I think it's important as well, we're not talking about doing it in a fake way. Like you mentioned. We've both mentioned authenticity. Yeah. And I think like, you can't be trustworthy if you're not authentic. Like, if it let's put it this way, if someone finds out that, like you, you were phony, in how you sort of went about, you know, establishing that personal connection, you've kind of blown up, like you've done more harm, you would have been better off, just keep it.

Alon Z
If I came through, and I asked you, hey, how's Harold your opinion roll?

Nick
out, but that wouldn't have been so bad because at least you got the hjr correct. So I knew like okay, like, Wow, that's pretty close. If you came back and said, hey, how's Randy? For the house, Randy, like, wow, that's like, he didn't even try. He should have just said, how's your son? Right. Let me

Alon Z
let me give you one more thing here. That will also make it super clear for the audience here. I recently changed my insurance agent, right? Car home. And

I looked at three suppliers.

Eventually, eventually, same coverage, same deductibles, same pricing, same everything subtle changes, you know, subtle that meaningless changes. How many times in life in our life? Do we go through a point where somebody needs to decide between us in one or two others? Especially when we sell something?

all the time?

Nick
Yeah, all the time?

Alon Z
What would make us different? How we made them feel? If they trust us, if we they look at the three offers, and they say this is Jim, this is Laura. This is Nick. Same pricing, same hate. But Nick is the guy that shared with us the story about Harrison and the hiking? Oh, yeah, that guy? That's right. Yep.

Nick
That's the difference. Can you repeat the three pillars it was stand out,

Alon Z
make an impact,

and get personal.

It's always a combination. It's not

Nick
just one of them. You know, I just I can't help but think like, I'm hoping that people who are listening to this stayed and held on throughout the whole thing, because I think there are nuggets of information here that are extremely valuable. And I think it's, um, it's not physics, like you can't put an equation to it. It's like what you said, you have to kind of roll up your sleeves requires elbow grease, you have to put the effort in. But it's, it is a dynamic difference, if you can execute on that if you can make those emotional connections, right in the way that we've been describing here. This isn't like I'm going to increase my profit my revenue by 20%. This is magnitudes. This is two x three x 10. x, because it's so different. But you have to put the effort in to be able to do that. And I'm hoping people hung on to it because this is useful. If you're a broker selling to a customer, a broker trying to get an underwriter to accept the policy, someone's selling to an investor or you know, trying to get an investor to invest in their company going up, you know, working with a European reinsurer or Bermudian banker, right to fund something or back something for you. It's you can't just put up a nice website. Right? Like

Alon Z
I say, it's an unfair advantage. I'll tell you why. You know how sometimes you meet somebody you don't remember the name, you know, you know them from somewhere, you met them 10 years ago. Again, you can't remember that you go to a conference and you bump into somebody, or you see somebody from across the hallway. And you know, you met them before. You don't remember the names where they work. But you remember the vibe. You remember the vibe. Now if it was a negative vibe, you may not remember why. But you remember they pissed you off. They got you frustrated, right? That emotional gut instinct is telling you this was a negative vibe with that person. That's it, you would have to really climb hard. They will have to really work hard enough to get you back. The unfair advantage is what I do I teach you to be able to control that. Make that a positive one. Yep. And an ongoing basis.

Nick
Okay. So we're gonna end there, the three pillar standout. I'm always talking about that, make it impact but get personal this was a lot of this conversation was about getting personal and how you can do that. So lots of nuggets of really solid information, Alon, I will have your connection in the show notes. So anyone that's listening, go to the show notes that will be how you can get connected with the lawn, we'll put a couple of other nice links in there as well. But I appreciate it. Thank you so much for coming on and having you know, I'm going to I'll test you in a few weeks and see if you still remember my kids names, but it it helps at least makes me feel better that like I've been subtly doing these things for a while. So thanks for coming on.

Alon Z
Thank you for having me, Nick. Big hug.

Nick
Big hug. We're huggers, big hug. For everyone that's listening. Thank you for tuning in, like us, wherever you follow us whether it's on YouTube, or iTunes or Google Play or Spotify, whatever, but please be safe, the world is locking down again. So it's not that big a deal. Just put a mask on wash your hands, be respectful of one another. And for lawn. My name is Nick Lamparelli. Until next time, thank you. Thanks a lot. Thank you

Transcribed by https://otter.ai